Re: The General Tolkien News Thread

[Sinister71]

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/peter-jackson-tolkien-estate-rights-753368?facebook_20141202

FINALLY... Now maybe every dumbass on TORn will quit begging for it...

[Eldorion]

I think he's made similar comments in the past, though perhaps not so clear cut. It won't stop people from wanting more movies though, and that doesn't make those people dumbasses.

[Sinister71]

I think he's made similar comments in the past, though perhaps not so clear cut. It won't stop people from wanting more movies though, and that doesn't make those people dumbasses.

well instead of dumass whats a good term for someone who has been told the same thing 999 million times and either doesn't listen or completely ignores what they were told because its not what they want to hear? I mean its no secret Jackson has no rights to anything other than what he has already butchered some of.

Everytime I hear the words Silmarillian and movies in the same sentence I say the exact same thing... no rights can't be done and they still keep coming out of the wood work.

[Eldorion]

I roll my eyes whenever I hear the latest argument for how The Silmarillion is actually totally available for adaptation, but (1) that doesn't mean I'm gonna be an asshole to the people saying that, and (2) most of the people I know who want a Silmarillion movie know it's impossible but still like to talk about what might happen if it magically became possible, because it's fun to speculate.

[malickfan]

We are of course ignoring the most obvious, and unlikely issue, even if Christopher Tolkien puts a stipulation is his will/sets up a trust deed forbidding the sale of further rights, the Tolkien Estate might end up developing their own film of the Sil 'In house' to assert their own view/ ensure a faifthful adapatation, it's incredibly unlikely (more so because very few filmakers would like the job of directing an adapation with no creative freedom) but I wouldn't rule it out entirely:

After all when The Children of Hurin was released, Mark Brawn then director at Harper Collins commented:

“We all want this first and foremost to enjoy life as a book,” said Brawn. “No one’s saying never to a film (but) the film rights are reserved by the estate. We want to see what reaction it gets and then let it run its course.”

It's likely that was just designed to drum up publicity for the book (though ironically one of the motives for publishing COH seems to have been to draw attention back to the books), but never say never.

[azriel]

After watching a reporter do his job & give us his view on the Hobbit Premiere in London, he ended by saying Peejers films will hopefully re-awaken a new generation to Tolkien & start reading his books. I can still hear in my minds lug'ole future kids going.." Its not like the films", I hope people get passed that & do read not just LOTRs/The Hobbit but The Sil & as many others also. Tolkien had a sing songy range from, heavy, heroic The Sil, ( I like Turin Turambar ) to gentle things like Father Christmas Letters.

[malickfan]

After watching a reporter do his job & give us his view on the Hobbit Premiere in London, he ended by saying Peejers films will hopefully re-awaken a new generation to Tolkien & start reading his books. I can still hear in my minds lug'ole future kids going.." Its not like the films", I hope people get passed that & do read not just LOTRs/The Hobbit but The Sil & as many others also. Tolkien had a sing songy range from, heavy, heroic The Sil, ( I like Turin Turambar ) to gentle things like Father Christmas Letters.

Well, I am a testament to that, I didn't read LOTR until 2007, and more likely than not I never would of, if I hadn't seen PJ's versions first. The huge increase in sales (look at the reviews pages for LOTR and The Hobbit on amazon, both have increased by thousands in recent years) is obviously a good thing, but whether not the current generation are inspired or interested by the source material as much as the films is open to debate.

And yeah, people should read more than LOTR and The Hobbit, I own copies of most of Tolkien's published work, and his 'minor' academic and creative works are just as important as the 'Big Three' (admittedly they might not be as likely to grab casual readers though), there is still a large amount of unpublished material, and at least two new books 'by' Tolkien are currently scheduled for release next year (The Art Of The Lord of The Rings and The Story of Kullervo, not to mention a reprint of the 'Expanded' editon of Smith of Wooton Major) so we'll still have lots to get excited/crabbit about as Tolkien fans.

[azriel]

[halfwise]

... I didn't read LOTR until 2007, and more likely than not I never would of, if I hadn't seen PJ's versions first. The huge increase in sales (look at the reviews pages for LOTR and The Hobbit on amazon, both have increased by thousands in recent years) is obviously a good thing, but whether not the current generation are inspired or interested by the source material as much as the films is open to debate.

Hmm...I'm sure you wrote about this when you first popped up here, but what effect did the differences between film and book have on you? Were the books anything like what you expected?

[malickfan]

... I didn't read LOTR until 2007, and more likely than not I never would of, if I hadn't seen PJ's versions first. The huge increase in sales (look at the reviews pages for LOTR and The Hobbit on amazon, both have increased by thousands in recent years) is obviously a good thing, but whether not the current generation are inspired or interested by the source material as much as the films is open to debate.

Hmm...I'm sure you wrote about this when you first popped up here, but what effect did the differences between film and book have on you?  Were the books anything like what you expected?

Honestly...I can't completely recall. I remember being extremely surprised by Frodo's age, and the slow pace at the start of FOTR (the first 'book' of FOTR is ironically now my favourite part of the book), the poems and songs fascinated me though I don't think they'd work in the film, I was 15 at the time so the 'lack' of action scenes confused and annoyed me, no crosscutting between Frodo/Aragorn's storyline in TT was very surprising and hard to deal with, Legolas and Gimli were totally different to how I thought they'd be (I had a vague notion I'd be reading a rollicking action adventure novel full of sharp quips and epic action...needless to say I was surprised!) and I think Jackson may have done better the Tolkien in working Arwen into the story.

I've read the book so many times since (I haven't watched the films in at least 2 years) It's kinda hard to remember my initial impressions, but it fundamentally felt like a different story, even if virtually all of the FOTR film (except perhaps the climax) and the productionm design did seem to reflect the spirit of a deep, ancient world full of wonder, Jackson's version feels more like a surface reading of the book, an entertaining interpretation to be sure (and perhaps the best we could have expected at the time) but the private fantasty World of an Oxford Scholar and the interpretation of an independent horror film director from New Zealand probably weren't destined to mesh faithfully.

I was a rather weird teenager...

[azriel]

"but the private fantasty World of an Oxford Scholar and the interpretation of an independent horror film director from New Zealand probably weren't destined to mesh faithfully." Malickfan.

By George he's cracked it !!

[malickfan]

Well, one of the ongoing lawsuits is settled, for now:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr-esq/warner-bros-prevails-weinsteins-hobbit-749187

[Eldorion]

We are  of course ignoring the most obvious, and unlikely issue, even if Christopher Tolkien puts a stipulation is his will/sets up a trust deed forbidding the sale of further rights, the Tolkien Estate might end up developing their own film of the Sil 'In house' to assert their own view/ ensure a faifthful adapatation, it's incredibly unlikely (more so because very few filmakers would like the job of directing an adapation with no creative freedom) but I wouldn't rule it out entirely:

I really don't think the Estate is going to sponsor a film on their own.  Certainly not while Christopher or Adam Tolkien are in charge.  It would go against everything they've said about adaptation in the last 10-15 years (since their comments have not been limited to criticizing PJ).

[malickfan]

We are  of course ignoring the most obvious, and unlikely issue, even if Christopher Tolkien puts a stipulation is his will/sets up a trust deed forbidding the sale of further rights, the Tolkien Estate might end up developing their own film of the Sil 'In house' to assert their own view/ ensure a faifthful adapatation, it's incredibly unlikely (more so because very few filmakers would like the job of directing an adapation with no creative freedom) but I wouldn't rule it out entirely:

I really don't think the Estate is going to sponsor a film on their own.  Certainly not while Christopher or Adam Tolkien are in charge.  It would go against everything they've said about adaptation in the last 10-15 years (since their comments have not been limited to criticizing PJ).

I said it was unlikely, but depending on what the Saul Zanetz company decides to do next, they might figure 'Why not?' if Hollywood ends up stretching the franchise to breaking point they might as well join in with a 'proper' adaptation, the damage is arguably done already.

[Eldorion]

Well, I am a testament to that, I didn't read LOTR until 2007, and more likely than not I never would of, if I hadn't seen PJ's versions first. The huge increase in sales (look at the reviews pages for LOTR and The Hobbit on amazon, both have increased by thousands in recent years) is obviously a good thing, but whether not the current generation are inspired or interested by the source material as much as the films is open to debate.

The movies definitely helped the book sales by making LOTR a cultural icon "of the moment", so to speak, which it hadn't really been since the '60s, but the books had long since ascended to that higher plane of long-standing classics and were among the best-selling and most-beloved novels of all time before the movies came out. LOTR was estimated to have sold something like 100 million copies pre-movies, and it won numerous polls for best book of the century during the late '90s, much to the chagrin of some of the poll-organizers, who considered it too lowbrow.

And yeah, people should read more than LOTR and The Hobbit, I own copies of most of Tolkien's published work, and his 'minor' academic and creative works are just as important as the 'Big Three' (admittedly they might not be as likely to grab casual readers though), there is still a large amount of unpublished material, and at least two new books 'by' Tolkien are currently scheduled for release next year (The Art Of The Lord of The Rings and The Story of Kullervo, not to mention a reprint of the 'Expanded' editon of Smith of Wooton Major) so we'll still have lots to get excited/crabbit about as Tolkien fans.

I can hardly blame people who liked LOTR and The Hobbit as adventure stories for being uninterested in Tolkien's academic essays or Christopher's scholarly analysis of his father's writing process. It'd be cool if more people read them but you kinda have to already be interested in the topics for it to be worth it.

[Eldorion]

I said it was unlikely, but depending on what the Saul Zanetz company decides to do next, they might figure 'Why not?' if Hollywood ends up stretching the franchise to breaking point they might as well join in with a 'proper' adaptation, the damage is arguably done already.

Obviously I can't do anything but speculate since I don't know any members of the Tolkien family, but the possibility had never even crossed my mind until it was brought up on here for the first time recently.

[Eldorion]

Well, one of the ongoing lawsuits is settled, for now:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr-esq/warner-bros-prevails-weinsteins-hobbit-749187

I didn't even know that was a thing.  The Weinsteins can be pretty scummy at times (this is hardly the worst example though).

[malickfan]

The movies definitely helped the book sales by making LOTR a cultural icon "of the moment", so to speak, which it hadn't really been since the '60s, but the books had long since ascended to that higher plane of long-standing classics and were among the best-selling and most-beloved novels of all time before the movies came outI have to confess, despite being English...I had never heard or them, nor had any of my family read them. I may or may not have read the hobbit when I a child, but I can't remember if that was prior to the LOTR films.  LOTR was estimated to have sold something like 100 million copies pre-moviesFeel sorry for the guy who tallies up the numbers, and it won numerous polls for best book of the century during the late '90s, much to the chagrin of some of the poll-organizers, who considered it too lowbrow. It's weird film critics don't have the same problem with the films


I can hardly blame people who liked LOTR and The Hobbit as adventure stories for being uninterested in Tolkien's academic essays or Christopher's scholarly analysis of his father's writing processThat is a fair point, you work in a book shop don't you? I've noticed when stores sell copies of his other writings they still put them on display with LOTR, I wouldn't imagine they sell very often.  It'd be cool if more people read them but you kinda have to already be interested in the topics for it to be worth itAgain, fair point..

[malickfan]

I haven't watched these yet, but they should be interesting, a short documentary about Tolkien's experiences in WW1, and a Short Biographical film:

http://www.kes.org.uk/tolkien-great-war.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTCc6Z3dAZI

And it looks like Tom Bombadil might be coming to screens after all:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3911896/

[malickfan]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/hobbit-real-life-battles-inspired-4766016

[Mrs Figg]

And it looks like Tom Bombadil might be coming to screens after all:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3911896/

If this is true I will be very happy to watch it.

[Mrs Figg]

just thinking the other day, I know C Tolkien and his son are against any more films, but the younger generation is defo into PJ, whatshisface Royd? Loyd? was in the ROTK as a soldier of Faramirs company.

[Pettytyrant101]

looks like Tom Bombadil might be coming to screens after all- Malick

That it refers to Tom as a hobbit does not bode well!

And why would Farmer Maggot have orc poison cures?
Why cant Tom sing the poison out?- thats more his style.
And how does a river spirit get poisoned in the first place?

[Mrs Figg]

looks like Tom Bombadil might be coming to screens after all- Malick

That it refers to Tom as a hobbit does not bode well!

And why would Farmer Maggot have orc poison cures?
Why cant Tom sing the poison out?- thats more his style.
And how does a river spirit get poisoned in the first place?

who cares, you can add Boms to your edit.

[feanor 1999]

Oh God...

What Half-assed Nonsense is THIS now...