Holidays and absences

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Post by Squach Thu Aug 22, 2013 11:47 pm

Oi! I've been busy playing my guitar and annoying my mum - someone has to do it y'know. Mad 

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Thu Aug 22, 2013 11:49 pm

Isnt that what you usually say Petty ?- Azriel

Yes, but its consistently true. drunken 

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Post by Orwell Thu Aug 22, 2013 11:54 pm

Eldorion wrote:You make some good points, Mrs Figg, but I feel that at least among the people in this thread, you are looking down on women who dress revealingly more than any of the men here.
No, I think Mrs Figg is doing the opposite, Eldo. But Figgy and Amarie, forgive him - he can't help it, he's Eldo for God's sake! and he meant no harm. It was just a slight misunderstanding of what you were getting at, Mrs Figg. Getting angry about it is all fine and good girls, but start thinking like men and get over it. Mad 


{{{There, that should ease all the angst. Nod... Must say, Amarie is quite sexy - not sexualized! - when she gets angry - I wonder what she's wearing....?}}}


Edit:  Actually, Mrs Figg is not actually doing the opposite on reflection, just showing a perceptive understanding of those forced by social pressure (if that's the right term) to do things that don't assist them personally or assist in terms of the bigger picture, the ongoing Women's Emancipation Movement.

{{{Oh God, I hate coming out in public support of women's equality - it does nothing for my dashing predatory image...Mad }}}  

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Post by Eldorion Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:15 am

I think maybe I should have highlighted the part of my posts where I limited my comment to people posting in this thread. I did try in immediately subsequent post to note that there are (obviously) tons of men who look down on (and do much worse) women who dress revealingly?  I wasn't making a blanket statement about the world nor was I trying to do several of the other things you seem to think I did.

I imagine you believe you worded yourself elegantly, which you generally do.
I can't say I spent that much time composing that post, so no, I don't really think I worded myself elegantly.  It's especially clear now that it wasn't a good post since it's clearly upset you a lot, but I make a lot of hastily-composed posts and I'm under no impression that most of them are especially profound or worthwhile.

But here you were simply repeating slime you have absorbed from friends, media, internet, school and everywhere your whole life. Of all the angles to choose, you went for the good old ‘women hates other women, ergo Figgy’s a bitch’. Why?
I didn't call Mrs Figg a bitch, nor do I think she is one.  I don't think she hates strippers or any other women either.  You're reading things into my post that are not present in my comment, although I can understand how the connotation is there.  Hence my aforementioned attempts to clarify my meaning.

It was not a clever observation; it is a typical low blow, with a poor attempt to make it sound fresh and valid.
I can't say that I was trying to be clever or fresh, and it was only meant to be valid insofar as it was my observation (which can always be incorrect!) regarding the tone of the three or four people posting in this thread at that time, so ... okay?

You knew this subject is very close to Figgy's heart, you knew it matters deeply to her. And yet you did that, and apparently still think it's funny or... what ever the point was? So yes, that was a bitch move.
No, I don't (didn't) know how personally Figgs feels about the topic.  I steer clear of most of the feminism and gender discussions on this forum (for a reason).  I am aware though that most discussions of real world issues in the Big Bad Serious Forum go pretty smoothly even when they're between people with wildly divergent opinions and yes, even when people make ill-considered or rude comments (I've been guilty of that my fair share of times).  So no, the comment wasn't meant to be funny, nor was it something I dwelt on for even a fraction of the time you apparently have.  I'm sorry that it offended you but I can't take responsibility for the layers of meaning that were not intended, though I can certainly acknowledge that they were present at some level and will do my best to avoid such issues in the future.


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Post by Eldorion Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:20 am

So I missed the entire last page when I was writing my earlier message.  I'll make one more comment.

Amarië wrote:I am confused about the apparent need to point out that women are cruel. Is it perhaps because when feminism is mentioned, one immediately thinks "they who hate men and feel women are superior and men are shit", so it's an attempt to gain balance, which we see as an attempt to undermine women and then we all dig ourselves a hole and all goes to hell from there?
I'm not sure if this paragraph was aimed at me in particular or the community in general, but I'd like to reiterate that my comment was one about individuals.  It was not intended to be a generalized or generalizable comment about anyone except the small group of people posting in this specific thread at the time when I made the comment.
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Post by Orwell Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:22 am

Eldorion wrote:No, I don't (didn't) know how personally Figgs feels about the topic.
Um... I'm amazed at that to be honest... where have you been? Shocked 

But good on you for fighting back. I was worried you may be feeling a bit damaged by all the vitriol coming from Mrs Figg and Amarie (and deflated by Petty's typical flaccid half cocked rearguard efforts to defend you - and Men generally... Yes, I know what he's up to! Very Happy)

{{{I don't take back my assertion that you're a totally incompetent Admin, Eldo, btw. Very Happy }}.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:24 am

and will do my best to avoid such issues in the future.- Eldo

I was with you right up till that point Eldo!
You always have two choices- stand by you words, or revise them in light of a new perspective- both are perfectly honourable positions to take.
Avoiding a topic to avoid upset is not in my view. Very anti-crabbit in principle. Mad

Orwell- Hey! With all the buckie in me half flaccid is a bloody miracle without resorting to a splint {{{ besides at least I was here to defend against the circling womenfolk Evil or Very Mad }}}

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Post by Eldorion Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:26 am

Orwell wrote:Um... I'm amazed at that to be honest... where have you been? Shocked 
Maybe I put too much stock into people being aware of the "don't take anything too seriously" rule of the forum.  Or maybe I've spent too much time talking to Petty and am used to overblown declarations that don't have the full force of conviction behind them.  Either way, like I said, I often skip these discussions and I don't know Figgy especially well.  Needless to say, I regret how this all turned out.

But good on you for fighting back. I was worried you may be feeling a bit damaged by all the vitriol coming from Mrs Figg and Amarie (and deflated by Petty's typical flaccid half cocked rearguard efforts to defend you - and Men generally... Yes, I know what he's up to! Very Happy)
Are you kidding?  I feel damaged when I (as a customer) say "have a good day" to the teenager at the checkout line in the supermarket and they don't reciprocate. Razz
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Post by Eldorion Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:27 am

Pettytyrant101 wrote:I was with you right up till that point Eldo!
You always have two choices- stand by you words, or revise them in light of a new perspective- both are perfectly honourable positions to take.
Avoiding a topic to avoid upset is not in my view. Very anti-crabbit in principle. Mad
I'll probably do both a little bit of revising and a little bit (maybe a lot Wink) of avoiding.
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:28 am

I've spent too much time talking to Petty and am used to overblown declarations that don't have the full force of conviction behind them- Eldo

Hey! Mad What is this diss Petty day?! Banghead 

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Post by Eldorion Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:30 am

Actually Petty that's the most charitable interpretation of many of your posts that I'm able to make. Very Happy
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:33 am

Mad 

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Post by Ringdrotten Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:10 am

I'm going away for a week on monday, and I'm not sure if I'll have internet or not. Probably not. See, now I've got this thread back on track Nod

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Post by Orwell Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:11 am

Had more time to think this over, and - sadly - I feel the need to put all joking aside.

Look Eldo, your explanations are all fine and good, but the issue at the heart of this is to be found highlighted in red below:

Eldorion wrote:You make some good points, Mrs Figg, but I feel that at least among the people in this thread, you are looking down on women who dress revealingly more than any of the men here.
That is clearly mistaken. She does not look down on these women and girls, full stop, and I'd be surprised if any of us here think she does - except for you, it seems. And Petty - maybe? Shrugging The core issue is this anyway: 'you are looking down on women who dress revealingly more than any of the men here'. Mrs Figg is right to be angered and hurt. Take note of the generally more measured Amarie - she's was angered too. Your comment went straight to the heart of who Mrs Figg is (and Amarie too, that goes without saying).

Sorry mate, but please focus on the central issue here.

I actually think you owe Mrs Figg an apology. I say this as your friend. Friends tell friends the truth.

Nonetheless, I think Mrs Figg and Amarie - knowing what a wonderful caring person you are - should forgive you, whether an apology is forthcoming or not, and accept you spoke mistakenly, and in no way deliberately committed a crime here.

And, yeah, we all say things that we might later regret - especially Petty. Very Happy


Last edited by Orwell on Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:22 am; edited 2 times in total

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Post by leelee Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:14 am

Wow I missed a lot.

Hey Petty I had to crow a little because our lads won so many awards in Scotland with the Bagpipes,
B.C. bagpipers show their stuff in Scotland. This is from our awesome Sun paper
Laughing Cheerleader Cheerleader Cheerleader 

B.C.’s ace bagpipers haven’t even had time to catch their breath.

After placing in the Top 5 at the World Pipe Band Championships in Glasgow on the weekend, the province’s pipers are again sweeping up in Scotland.

Three B.C. pipers — including two from the Simon Fraser University Pipe Band — have won the top awards at the 2013 Argyllshire Gathering in Oban, according to staff at Simon Fraser University.

SFU Pipe Sergeant Jack Lee took first prize in a piping contest called the Senior Piobaireachd, held for past gold medal winners, while SFU Piper Alan Bevan won the Highland Society of London gold medal.

Vancouver Island piper James Troy took the contest’s silver medal, and Andrew Bonar, of Surrey, placed fourth in the gold medal contest.

Wednesday’s victories complete the first of the two-day event, this year being held just days after the World Championships.

Ahead of the championships, Lee, a resident of Surrey, also won the Masters Solo competition during Glasgow’s Piping Live, earning him a spot at the prestigious Glenfiddich contest in October.

He’ll also be joined by Bevan, of Abbotsford, who earns a spot at Glenfiddich after his gold medal win at Oban.

“The results coming in from the solo contests in Scotland show the enduring strength of SFU band members,” said band manager Rob MacNeil. in a statement, released Wednesday evening by SFU staff.

“SFU remains very much a contender in world competition in years ahead.”

The band placed fourth at the World Championships in Glasgow on the weekend. They were competing against 225 bands from 17 countries in the two-day event with more than 30,000 spectators in attendance.


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Post by Pettytyrant101 Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:16 am

I regret nothing Orwell! Especially the really regrettable stuff. drunken


Yes they did exceptionally well leelee- I watched it on tv- they were unlucky it choose to pour with rain right in the middle of their performance- damn tricky thing to play in a down pour a bagpipe.

I am hoping they will grace our local Highland Games in a weeks time.

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Post by CC12 35 Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:30 am

But Mrs Figg is clearly looking down on strippers and prostitutes by suggesting that they are somehow being conned and that they don't possess the moral intellect to live in this patriarchal world without being exploited?

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Post by halfwise Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:39 am

Whoo, revving things up again. :carrot: 

Actually it seemed very clear to me Figgs was largely ticked off by Petty, not Eldo. but we've come to expect that.

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Post by Orwell Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:45 am

I think you're wrong, Kooky. In my opinion, it's only if you don't actively engage in what Mrs Figgs says on these issues that you can make comments like that. Yes, I can see how one might jump to the conclusion you made - Mrs Figg does say things 'spontaneuously' sometimes Very Happy - but I think you need to look a bit deeper. She's pretty consistent in her ideas about these things. I suspect prostitution doesn't necessarily please Mrs Figg, but she does not ever really blame or condemn or 'look down' on prostitutes in any general sense. Her angst is more about the power of 'social pressures' I reckon, though she does not always see prostitutes as always 'blameless' either - but that doesn't ever mean she's looking down in my opinion. Mind, maybe I should shut up and stop talking for her. Very Happy 

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Post by Orwell Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:50 am

halfwise wrote:Whoo, revving things up again. :carrot: 

Actually it seemed very clear to me Figgs was largely ticked off by Petty, not Eldo.  but we've come to expect that.
Maybe I picked the wrong offence, Halfy, but I stand by what I said. If it wasn't about the Quote I chose from Eldo, then I'll just have to be hurt on Mrs Figg's part in spite of what she herself thinks. Very Happy I did note she took exception to Eldo's comment and things seemed to sour considerably after that. Petty's input, it seems to me, miffed her too - as usual - but Eldo's words were at the heart of it either way. Maybe I'm wrong. I remember being wrong once, before I realized I was mistaken. Very Happy

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Post by CC12 35 Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:06 am

I'm sorry but Mrs Figg lampooned 'bimbos' and said that women who 'show flesh' are seen by the majority of society as 'thick slappers'. Mrs Figg doesn't even, in her several posts, entertain the notion that they are able to think for themselves and then continues onto an offensive tirade insulting their feminist values.

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Post by Eldorion Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:14 am

Orwell wrote:That is clearly mistaken. She does not look down on these women and girls, full stop, and I'd be surprised if any of us here think she does - except for you, it seems. And Petty - maybe? Shrugging
I was unsure of this for the same reasons that CC has just pointed out, but I'd be more than happy to let Mrs Figg speak for herself when she returns.  If she finds my statement as baseless as you do, then I'll apologize to her.  I'm going to point out though that Mrs Figg did not make any comment herself on my post.  The one post that I thought was directed at me was not, as she said >here<, and she stopped posting immediately after.

Take note of the generally more measured Amarie - she's was angered too.
I've already apologized to Amarie for offending her since in her case it's plenty clear that she was, indeed, offended. Wink


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Post by halfwise Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:16 am

I'm just gonna sit tight. Have we upgraded to caramel popcorn yet?

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Post by Orwell Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:19 am

CC12 35 wrote:I'm sorry but Mrs Figg lampooned 'bimbos' and said that women who 'show flesh' are seen by the majority of society as 'thick slappers'. Mrs Figg doesn't even, in her several posts, entertain the notion that they are able to think for themselves and then continues onto an offensive tirade insulting their feminist values.
Exactly why I said I think I can see why you could make the comment you made earlier.

Please note the first highlighted bit of the quote above. Don't we all 'lampoon' at times to make a bigger point - and express our frustration with some folks at times. That does not necessarily translate to 'looking down' but to being annoyed (at times) with.

The second highlighted bit seems a frustrated comment on what she sees as common held views - which don't help the Feminist cause. Whatever the wider society think - and I'm fairly sure Mrs Figg is on the money with that - it almost suggests that these ladies are 'wilfully' allowing people to think of them that way. I wish Mrs Figg would come back and correct me if I'm wrong, though, as I'm not comfortable trying to speak for others. But - Oh well! - she's not here and I feel obliged to defend (what I think) are her views.  Mad


Last edited by Orwell on Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:21 am; edited 2 times in total

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Post by David H Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:20 am

I'm just gonna sit tight. Have we upgraded to caramel popcorn yet?

No but I'll run out to the lobby and get some. Here, hold my Coke. I'll be right back!


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