US General Elections 2020

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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:29 am

{{ Agreed. When this awful calmity is finally over he should face charges for every death caused by his misinformation- from all those who took his touted malaria drugs that it turns out are more likely to kill you than help, to anyone stupid enough to try putting disinfectents into themselves (and it seems given the apparent IQ of Trump supporters some of them probably will).
He should face criminal charges for negligence and man-slaughter for this. }}

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Post by odo banks on Sat Apr 25, 2020 6:36 am

Now, he was clearly being sarcastic about something or other about disinfectants and haircuts and lots of sunshine. The medical doctors should be trialling things. And I mean that sarcastically and seriously. Typical Scotshobbit and your Lefty attitudes. And Orwell, getting almost as bad as you. No wonder people, great people, beautiful orange skinned tremendous people, like Mr Trump, get sarcastic and or serious when they are considering lots of advice from social media and some other people in his office....medical doctor type people, I think... people that don’t say much and have looks on their faces which look like they might be about to laugh or cry...or maybe about to say something serious or sarcastic... or both... it all seems to depend a lot on the reaction... Mr Trump reacts according to the reactions... Perfect sense, thank you very much. How can one do anything but react to reactions? How are you supposed to say anything serious (or sarcastic) until you get a reaction, which you can then clarify as...umm.... as something needing reacting to!?

You know, I think Mr Trump needs to be put in charge. I say, let him take charge! Someone needs to take charge? I think someone should take charge! Why not Mr Trump? He has a very nice orange complexion. Beautiful hue! Tremendous! Why do fools bait him so? Don’t people realise thousands of people are dying! And with any number of disinfectants on the market!  My storage facilities have thousands of them. Some of them tested on bench tops! Forsooth! Extremely Crabbit

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Post by halfwise on Sat Apr 25, 2020 2:50 pm

Pettytyrant101 wrote:{{{  Laughing  I am not sure from within America folk are quite aware of just what a joke America has become on the international stage. }}

Half of us know full well. The other half (well, 40%) believe in all honesty that America has regained its standing on the world stage. They're damn proud, these people - no telling them otherwise.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Sat Apr 25, 2020 3:40 pm

{{ Like I say wouldnt be so bad except its left a massive power vaccum unsavoury sorts are trying very hard to fill. And if the EU completely falls apart too it'll only be worse. }}

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Post by halfwise on Sun Apr 26, 2020 6:45 pm

Petty - this is the kind of thing we're dealing with. It's hero worship, really.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-offered-confusing-coronavirus-theory-162242768.html

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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Sun Apr 26, 2020 10:29 pm

{{ Thats just depressing Halfy. I dont know whats gone wrong in the US over the years, whether its the 'American Dream' made everyone ridiculously selfish and selfcentered, or if its a failure of the education system leading to ignorance of the rest of the world, science and well knowledge in general (your nation did elect a President whose grasp on concepts seems to equal the education level of what, here would maybe be a not too bright twelve year old) or what it is, but something is very wrong. }}

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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Wed May 06, 2020 10:41 pm

{{ Perhaps a UShobbit can enlighten me on this- the US judical system. I watched the hearing for the latest judge nominee. And it seems to me that becoming a judge in the US is no less a political act or career than becoming a politician. This particualr judge, being a Trump nominee, was from the right of politics. Clearly from the right, openly Republican supporting, from how the yhave interpreted laws in the past, to statements they have publicly made, to rulings they have made. And I assume their opposite also exists, left wing judges who rule according to Democratic politics.
My question is, is this really how it works? And why would this be seen by the people as law or justice? Which are supposed to be impartial as humanely possible and certainly not political.
Here there is a clear divide between judiciary and political class, not as much as I would like, but its mainly there to demonstrate trust to the people. The independence of the judiciary is considered one of the main pllars and central necessitites of democracy. Without which you dont have a democracy. How did the US judiciary get so politictised? And why is its politicisation not considered a threat to US democracy?}}

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Post by halfwise on Wed May 06, 2020 11:11 pm

Up until the late 80's congressional approval of judges followed largely the lines you suggested: they just checked that the judge was indeed qualified and not morally outrageous, then confirmed him.

But then Ronald Reagan nominate Robert Bork for the Supreme Court.  Turns out Bork would have liked to overturn many of the earlier civil rights rulings, and would have been a deciding vote in the liberal versus conservative votes on the Supreme Court.  The democratic congress successfully blocked it, and the unprecedented act of denying confirmation due to politics rather than qualifications became part of the lexicon: the next time it happened, the nominee was said to have been "Borked".

As the gulf between parties widened through the decades it became the standard rather than the exception.  But with Trump the tables have been turned even further: he tends to nominate judges based purely on ideology, with qualifications often being laughable.  It's often not necessary to Bork a judge, the opposing party just has to point out the complete lack of qualifications.

But even in the time of Trump rejecting a judge due to ideology is very common.  It's worse now that the Republicans held up the nomination of Merrick Garland for a full year, saying that Obama was in his last term, so everyone should wait until the next election when "the people would decide" via their choice of president.  After that behavior there's been no attempt to disguise idealogical rejection.

So yes, this country is in a deplorable state politically.   I have faint hopes of coming up for air if Trump gets thrown out, but even if he does I don't see much hope.  The damage right now is too deep.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Wed May 06, 2020 11:44 pm

{{ Well at least seems there are folk who have at least noticed it and that its a bit of a big problem. Thats something.
Only thing I can think of would be a president who will have a proper reset, from the education and training level of judges to the Supreme Court. Instigating a strong focus throughout on impartiality, and on reading the law within the context of the times without political considerations. Then remove ever judge from the supreme court, change it to a fixed term service not for life, and have a new set of judges apppointed, with Congress still holding oversight through hearings, but any overtly political accusations or directing and that is not needed for judging a judges carer and work in law would be struck off immediatly and ignored and the member replaced. And any other changes needed to remove the ability for political pressure to be exerted on judges should also be looked at and removed.

Thats drastic, but the alternative, that you turn the Law and Justice merely into the service of politics and politicians, that it becomes a mere tool of government, is a far greater and more drastic result. One which would undermine the very notion of democracy in the US. Democracies don't run the law, they are supposed to set it and then adhere to it, nor are the leaders of democracies supposed to be above it, not PM's, FM's or Presidents. If they own and run Law and Justice, if they are above it as a result then its simply no longer a true democracy.}}

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Post by halfwise on Thu May 07, 2020 12:09 am

Nearly everyone feels the system is broken. One reason Trump is there now is people thought he might actually shake things up enough to get a reset. Sort of like tossing a bomb in the kid's room to get it cleaned up.

It's clear now that no president will be able to reset our system. Obama was supposed to be the soul of rationality, but Republicans ran all over him and he had to resort to shady measures to get Obamacare passed, which only served to let conservatives point to it as proof that they were right to block him all along.

Don't know yet if covid will be the needed shake up, but I doubt it.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Thu May 07, 2020 12:40 am

{{ The really worrying possibility is that it continues as it has unabated. And that in order to effectviely make Law and Justice solely a potical tool the country has gone so far in partisian division, that you would end up with a sizeable percent of your population not only not seeing the threat, but actively supporting the government taking control over the judiciary. With the government selling it as them ensuring they can enact their agenda without inteference from biased judges, thus defending the peoples democratic vote and rights in electing the government.
If it reaches such a publicly open and entrenched position then you will have lost one of the main pillars of democracy, your independent judiciary, with the blesssing of a large chunk of the US population.
That would be the worst outcome, as where do you go from there? A second civil war? States seceding? Or a country where the government directly controls the judges along purely idealogical lines?}}

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Post by halfwise on Fri May 08, 2020 8:04 pm


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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Sun May 31, 2020 4:24 pm

{{ Well it madness in the US- your lockdown is a bit of aa joke it seems, I predict resurgances of coronavirus in the US (you already lead the world in deaths per head of population) and meantime your cities are exploding in riots after yet anohter brutal murder of a black person at hands of cops, and your President has decided to further withdraw from the global stage by cancelling the G7 and dissing it members whilst taking on social media and attempting to silence anyone who dares point out his lies!
Just as well America is such a bible-bashing country of religous nutters as only a God could save America now I fear. }}

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Post by halfwise on Sun May 31, 2020 4:33 pm

Wait, I thought Trump was saving America! Shocked

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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Sun May 31, 2020 5:07 pm

{ Well lets see how America is doing!
Before Trump the US was a respected world leader, if there was a crisis or global pandemic the US would lead. Morally the US was the becon, the shining light on the hill, a symbol for democratic freedom and justice across the globe.
Since Trump America has offended or inuslted most of its allies whilst praising tyrants, dictators and nutjobs- from Saudia to N Korea via Russia.
America has withdrawn for all important international agreements designed after WW2 to maintain peace. You have pulled out of the Climate Agreement, the Iran agreement, bad mouthed the G7 and other international bodies, withdrawn funding for political reasons from the World Health Organisation in the middle of a global pandemic and now are going to withdraw entirely. Sided 100% with Israel in the so-called Peace Plan which actually kills off any hope of peace whatsoever and condemns the Palestinian people. Torn up nuclear profilation treaties and other international treaties deisgned to maintian peace.
You've started damaging and pointless global trade wars with almost everyone, damaging the global economy and making life harder for everyone everywhere.
You have stoked iternally racist and white supremicist thought for political gain and stoked religous differnces also for politcal gain. Maintaining division, dissent and pain has become the daily norm in the US as it helps reelect Trump.
Meanwhile racism, gun assault and deaths go through the roof- we have seen what by any other name was two outright lynchings in the US in recent weeks. And your President responds by tweeting a racist threat from the 1960's and blaming the victims.
Trump has removed or forced out anyone of importance and with authority to question or stand up to him, and replaced them with Yes Men and lackeys such as Barr, turning the entire US system of checks and balances on the President into a toothless animal that merely serves Trumps whims. And leaving no one to challenge or fairly scrutinise his actions.
Meanwhile globally, in the void left by the US, taking a lead China has stepped into the gap, proving massive aid and assistent especially to Africa, India and the sub-contintent whilst peddling soft power in the traditional western US allies.
No one looks to Ameica for leadership any more- your President was publicly advocating people take bleach as a cure and regularly tweets about long debunked conspiracy theroes to bad mouth rivals. And now he is trying through legisaltion to silence anyone who dares question is words of wisdom or speaks out against his mad diatribes.
Who is going to turn to an obvious madman in a crisis? Or even in times of peace? No one. And no one is. }}

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Post by halfwise on Sun May 31, 2020 5:18 pm

But....he's making America great again! Surely you're missing something.

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Post by malickfan on Sun May 31, 2020 9:45 pm

Petty you make very good points...but I think the scariest/strangest thing about Trump is that he still has a good chance of being re-elected.

...On the other hand you could argue some of his recent behaviour/actions suggest he's getting increasingly desperate and falling apart under the stress of the job/fearing he will lose the election (And therefore open himself up to legal actions again).

If things are this crazy now, how much worse will they get between November and January if he does lose the election? If Trump knew he was on the way out, frankly he seems the sort of person to burn down the building and take everyone else with him...


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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Sun May 31, 2020 10:44 pm

{{ Malick I honestly dont think the stress of the job touches Trump. I dont think he grasps the responsibilities of the job, his mind is reductionary, he just reduces the world to a few things he feels certain about. It would take a cleverer more intelligent person to feel those pressures.
What I find scareist is that Trump does not run America, he rules it, which is a different thing. The actual day to day running of America at Federal level is being done by other people, Trump has no grasp of detail and no care for them, information and facts bore him- they have neverr been necessary to his success, where bullying and cajolling, threatening and besmirching have always worked better for him.
So the result is you have people, appointed by Trump, to run things. Now these people mostly do their job in fear of Trump, in fear of losing his approval and becoming the focus of a Twitter spree and tirade. Of loss of reputation, job and future at a tweet for displeasing their Master. Or worse end up in jail like so many of hs former employees.
But the Master doesn't do the details, doesn't give direct instructions. So if you're oneof those people appointed by Trump how do you do your job? You do it according to how you think he wants it done, according to what you think will please him based on what he does say. And there is no one left in your department of integrety or strength of character to see things are done properly, fairly, or scrupulously, they have all been purged. You've already seen what happens to those who don't play along.

This is how scary regimes like Nazi Germany and Stalins Russia oiperated. Not by everyone doing exactly what they were told, but by poeple doing what they interpreted as being what they were told. Its known that Hitlers Generals used to form policy based on things he would say at a dinner party. Some of the worst atrocities happened this way, not because Hitler directly ordered them to happen, but because his Generals and officers did what they thought would please him based on is rhetoric and pronouncements.
Thats what really scares me about Trump, that all the ways of holding a President to charge have not stood up to a Presidnet who simply ignores them, bulies into silence the institutions designed to scutinize him, or replaces all the leading members with yes men of his own choosing.
The only pople left are those either loyal to Trump, or to cowed to do anything other than what they think, based on his tweets and rambling speeches and rallies, is what he wants them to do.

You have a President who has inflamed racial tensions and used racial slurs and rhetoric, who has a past of racism, and who was the driving force behind a conspiracy theory to prove that Americas first black President was not a real American at all.
And now you have had two, what look like almost open, lynchings.
This is not a coincidence. When those who follow Trump, and those who work for him are both doing the same thing, interpreting that rhetoric directly and turning it into actions, this is what will happen. And worse will follow. And if Trump if releected America may never be the same shining light on the hill it once was ever again. There may be no going back from the divisions he will leave behind (not to mention by then America may be a fast receding memory as a serious or important international partner, superceded by China and India filling the gulf left behind diplomatically and in production of goods.}}}}

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Post by halfwise on Mon Jun 01, 2020 11:43 am

I've noted his eery similarity to Mussolini. That he could even be elected says all you need to know. But Mussolini was eventually strung up. There's hope.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:52 pm

{{ I see China is openly mocking Tump and the US now. In reposnse to the ongoing race protests they had this to say-

'China's foreign ministry spokespersons, Hua Chunying posted "I can't breathe."
'"I have a question for violent protesters in Hong Kong and their supporters there: Would you stand with angry Minneapolis demonstrators who attacked police station, or would you stand with President Trump who threatens to shoot 'These THUGS'?" Hu Xijin, the editor-in-chief of the state-run Global Times, wrote in a tweet.
"I want to ask Speaker Pelosi and Secretary Pompeo: Should Beijing support protests in the US, like you glorified rioters in Hong Kong?"
Why did the U.S. glorify the so-called pro-independence forces in Hong Kong as heroes, but call the protesters disappointed with racism in the U.S. rioters?" Zhao Lijian, a spokesman for Chinese foreign ministry..."Why did the U.S. criticize the very restrained Hong Kong police but shoot its domestic protesters and even mobilise its National Guard troops?"

This what Trump's America is opening the way for, China to on one hand push their own agenda and policies globally, whilst using the freedoms of the west, such as free speech and platforms like Twitter (iilegal in China itself) to make reasonable sounding arguments against the US, and at same time they are steppinginto funding breach left behind by US in WHO, stepping up their climate agreements and taking a more active role diplomatically, using soft power on the West and behind the scenes they are using every means to gain favour and power in corners of the world abandoned by Trumps America, like Africa. }}

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Post by Mrs Figg on Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:14 pm

You know the Book of Revelations? Trump is in there.

Long was this foreseen, and I mean, Long.

The description of the false prophet/anti-Christ  fits him perfectly. He is an evil man, evil men cause suffering and death, but quite often they end up like Mussolini, strung up in the city square or hiding in a ditch. Johnson and Bolsonaro are his lieutenents, their supporters are their Legion. How else can he be seen but evil? he kills his people in a deadly plague, he murders immigrants and Black people, he stokes racism, he destroys the planet, he abuses women. The list is endless. The one good ray of light is that people are waking up and good people will not allow him to flourish.

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Post by halfwise on Mon Jun 01, 2020 7:58 pm

I wouldn't be so sure until the election. We all misjudged him and the voting public before. And now we have Biden routinely shoving his foot in his mouth, or looking on the verge of senility at times. He is not the strong candidate we need.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 on Mon Jun 01, 2020 8:25 pm

{{ Trump's response to events has been that of a would-be dictator-

'the president told governors: "You have to dominate, if you don't dominate you're wasting your time. They're going to run over you, you're going to look like a bunch of jerks. You have to dominate.You’ve got to arrest people, you have to track people, you have to put them in jail for 10 years and you’ll never see this stuff again," he said, according to audio obtained by CBS News.'- BBC News

This is what countries like China, Russia and Saudi do with protests and riots, grab a random bunch and lock them up in a public trial and throw away the key.
Never mind the underlying issues leading to it of systematic poverty, racism and violence, alcohol, drug abuse and mental health issues left unaddressed and unhelped in the most vulnerable groups in society. No, a show of strength, attack those protesting their circumstances, threaten them, lock them up, blame them for it and beat them down.

Trump compared whats going on to the civil rights clashes of the 60's -

'Trump called the unrest, the largest wave of national protests since the 1960s, "a war in a certain sense"'

Given his response is to hit harder and quell all protests its interesting how he must view the events of the 60's, presumably as a loss for the country as by and large the civil rights movement won the 'war' of their day. Yet here we have Trump comparing this to that and saying they should be stopped, locked up and be met with authority and a show of power. A 'war' no less. This time he wants the government to win the civil rights battle and oppose it. Despite the fact the government of the 60's tried that too and its now seen as one of the blacker periods in modern US history. But still Trump wants to repeat it and win this time.}}

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Post by halfwise on Mon Jun 01, 2020 8:39 pm

"Civil rights" is too abstract a concept for his brain to handle. And I'm not saying that sarcastically, I honestly don't think he's capable of fully comprehending it.

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Post by Forest Shepherd on Tue Jun 02, 2020 4:04 am

pfft you guys lol

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