continuing proofs America is wacko [2]

whats up with Polish potatoes?  

A few minutes of poking around on Google suggests that a bacterial disease called "ring rot" was found in Polish potatoes in 2003 or 2004 and the law was passed as a measure against that.

i don't think we have any messed up laws... but then again.. our laws were put together in six weeks.. so i dunno

Hmm, Norway seems to have excaped pretty much unscathed.  The "dumb laws" listed for Norway are not really that dumb or weird. Maybe the no-spaying one.

http://www.dumblaws.com/laws/international/norway

well.. some believe it ain't healthy for the dog/cat. 

aslo this is not dumb, it's called recycling!

A fee is levied on each purchaser of any plastic bottlewhich is returned upon return of the bottle.

and this is pretty smart, considering the roads in norway.. them having lots of turns and icy and dar and etc. etc. u may wanna know if there is a car laying there and if a person might pop up.

If your vehicle stalls and you leave it on the side of the road, you must mark the vehicle with a red, reflectingtriangle.

though they are a bitch to put up in minus 30 ...

Yeah, the plastic bottle fee exists in a bunch of US states as well.  Though I don't know anyone who bothers to collect the fee and I'm not even sure how one goes about doing that.

The reflective triangle thing is just common sense in many circumstances.

" A fee is levied on each purchaser of any plastic bottlewhich is returned upon return of the bottle."

Yeah, this is a good thing. Makes many people who would otherwise throw bottles away recycle them instead

"though they are a bitch to put up in minus 30 ..." - Norc

Life in general is a bitch when it gets below 30

Ringdrotten wrote:
"though they are a bitch to put up in minus 30 ..." - Norc

Life in general is a bitch when it gets below 30

haha.. no. as long as u have glovs u should be ok.

Gloves or no gloves, I used to curse quite a lot when I lived right next to a lake that for some reason made the temperatures drop down to minus 37-38 Waiting for the school bus that was almost always late wasn't much fun then

aw, poor u  in january when the sun comes back (and in autumn) i am in the perfect positino for a sunbath in the morning, if i am wearing dark pants it's heaven  as long as there is no wind..snow.. rain... clouds... ice.... ...

Eldorion wrote:Yeah, the plastic bottle fee exists in a bunch of US states as well.  Though I don't know anyone who bothers to collect the fee and I'm not even sure how one goes about doing that.

Usually the retailers who sell the beverages and collect the fee are expected to also redeem the bottles and cans. Washington Oregon and California all have something like this. Not only does it provide an incentive to environmentally conscious people, but it also provides extra income to low income people and small non-profit organizations who can collect the bottles and cans and return them for cash. It reduces the cost of recycling programs, and in states with such programs you almost never see cans and bottles alongside roads.

In every apartment building in New York, the morning rustling and clanking as freelance recyclers go through the bags set out for recycling is a common sound.  Sure, they are effectively stealing from the city's recycling program, but they also go rummaging through public trashcans looking for the loot.  Their 'borrowed' shopping carts with bulging bags hanging off all sides and piled high on top are a common sight.  I like 'em.  I salute them.  It's just too bad most populations aren't dense enough to support an underworld of recyclers.

as long as they are recycled that's fine by me

This annoys me no end. The missionaries I knew during my time in Africa were running hospitals and schools; those that came to their churches were attracted by good examples, not by prosetylizing aimed at the young.


Culture war: Film links U.S. Evangelicals to intolerance against gays in Uganda
By Rick Klein, Olivier Knox, Richard Coolidge, and Jordyn Phelps


Are American Evangelicals to blame for a surge of anti-gay sentiment and violence in Uganda?

Roger Ross Williams, the director of the new documentary “God Loves Uganda,” told “Top Line” that American Evangelical missionaries are contributing to a raging culture war over homosexuality in Uganda, where just a few years ago a law was proposed that prescribes the death penalty for certain homosexual acts.

“All the Evangelicals I followed told me they feel like they've lost the culture war here in America as marriage equality has passed state by state, the recent Supreme Court rulings, but they are winning in the global South and especially in Africa and Uganda,” Williams said.

Williams’ documentary looks specifically at the prominent ministry in Uganda by the American Evangelical group known as the International House of Prayer (IHOP).

“They don't do any humanitarian work,” Williams said. “They don't build schools or hospitals or help people. … It's a numbers game, convert souls, and that's it.”

Ministries like the International House of Prayer, Williams’ said, are preying on a vulnerable population.

“Uganda is a very vulnerable population to the sort of prosperity gospel and that message,” he said. “They're poor, they're sick, and you come in and you say we're going to cure you, we're going to heal you. It works.”

And their Evangelical message, which teaches that homosexuality is a sin, is inadvertently contributing to religiously-fueled, and sometimes violent, intolerance against the LGBTI community in Uganda.

“For a lot of these young people, it is a time to have an adventure, but for the poor African listening to this, they think that’s how it should be,” said one Ugandan minister, who believes American Evangelical ministry is having negative effects on his country, in the film.

When contacted about this story, the International House of Prayer responded with an official statement of their belief about the sanctity of marriage and said the documentary provides misinformation about their ministry.

"The IHOPKC leadership team upholds the New Testament view of the sanctity of sex in the context of marriage between one man and one woman,” the statement said. “However, we strongly oppose victimization or violence against any sector of society that disagrees with the biblical view. We honor the dignity and rights of all who differ from us."

Recently back from a tour to promote his film in Africa, Williams said his film has sparked a conversation that he hopes will lead to increased tolerance and acceptance for the LGBTI community in Africa.

“It was amazing, because the people from the LGBTI community came out in public for the first time and addressed the faith leaders and said, ‘You've made our lives miserable,’” Williams said of a screening of the film in Malawi. “And some of the faith leaders, they stood up and they said, ‘You know what, we take back what we've said about you. We've never met a gay person, we thought they were monsters.’”

And while Williams said he doubts he’ll be “welcome back at the International House of Prayer,” of which his film is critical, he hopes his film will cause American Evangelicals to reconsider how they minister abroad.

For more of the interview with Williams, including how he says U.S. aid to Africa has also been affected by Evangelical zeal, check out this episode of “Top Line.”

ABC News’ Alexandra Dukakis, Gary Westphalen, Melissa Young and David Girard contributed to this episode.

see video:

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/power-players-abc-news/culture-war-film-links-u-s--evangelicals-to-intolerance-against-gays-in-uganda-191437464.html?vp=1

I recall hearing about this before and it's some fucked up shit. I don't know how these people are able to sleep at night knowing what they're doing.

Spoiler:

Evangelicals live in a bubble. Like the ministers in Uganda, most of them have probably never met a gay person, except in passing. Bubble cultures have resulted in many of the great evils throughout history.

Thats terrible- evil out of evil. But then when you go about trying to spread the word of and following a homophobic God to which you encourage poorly educated folks to join it is perhaps not unexpected.

I suspect Eldo, they sleep very well, contentedly and smugly, knowing that with every homosexual attacked, tortured or murdered God is that bit happier and Uganda one more step closer to being a true Christian country with no gay people left in it, or at least no gay people not to terrified to admit it.  

wow thats sick minded shit.

Has America just made a huge mistake in Afghanistan?

Theother day the US killed by drone a Taliban leader.

Unfortunately they choose to do this three days before an official Pakistani delegation was to meet with the Taliban for tentative openings to peace talks.

"Pakistan's interior minister has said the death of Pakistani Taliban leader Hakimullah Mehsud has destroyed the country's nascent peace process.
This is not just the killing of one person, it's the death of all peace efforts," Chaudhry Nisar Ali Khan said.
Mr Nisar accused the United States of "scuttling" efforts to begin peace talks, and said "every aspect" of Pakistan's co-operation with Washington would be reviewed.
Information Minister Pervez Rashid said: "The US has tried to attack the peace talks with this drone but we will not let them fail."
A Pakistani Taliban spokesman, Azam Tariq, vowed revenge, as Pakistan's security forces were put on high alert.
"Every drop of Hakimullah's blood will turn into a suicide bomber," he said. "America and their friends shouldn't be happy because we will take revenge for our martyr's blood."
The Pakistan government has strongly condemned the drone attack as a violation of Pakistan's sovereignty.- BBC

So has the US made a complete cock-up on this?
And should the US have a right to conduct assassinations on other peoples soil?- one can only imagine the response in America if such a thing were to happen there carried out by a foreign power who then said they had a right to as it was in their national security interests.

Yep it was a stupid mistake. I think so many pieces are moving that the people who knew Hakimullah was actually part of the peace process never communicated with the people operating the drones - he was on the hit list, on it rolls.

I have severely mixed feelings about the drone program. Yes, the people in these countries have every reason to be furious, but on the other hand I'm not sure anything else has been as successful breaking up terrorist organizations. How different is it from counter-espionage? If the US asks governments permission, then they share in the backlash: no government would allow such a thing. And it will all be for naught if anger causes more terrorists to spring up of course.

The whole thing is creepy.

They must have known about the peace talks- its been in the media plenty and its not like it just happened out of nowhere- these talks have been on the table and been getting negotiated behind the scenes for some time- it beggars belief that the US did not know about them. I knew about them, they must have.

Which begs the question were they trying to scupper peace talks?
Given its not the US its Pakistan who sees weekly terrorist atrocities carried out it seems an incredibly arrogant thing to have done, as well as stupid.

I've been thinking about this tonight and I think that the United States should commit more firmly to the idea of negotiation.  I know there's the whole "we don't negotiate with terrorists" thing, but we can't think of the Taliban as exactly the same as al-Qaeda.  For one, they're not the ones who attacked us on 9/11, and they're not an global organization with an eye to world domination.  They're a nationalist organization with geographically limited ambitions and, crucially, deep connections and support from many of the Pashtun people in Afghanistan and Pakistan.  The utter clueness of the United States in understanding the difference between the Taliban and al-Qaeda has stymied our efforts to achieve anything meaningful in the war.  It was worst at the start of the conflict when we struggled to find military or intelligence professionals who could speak Farsi or Pashto, but public awareness still lags behind.

As far as I can tell, these types of conflicts between local guerrillas and standing armies tend to end one of three ways (and they do end sooner or later, because you can't fight a war forever, especially not if it's on the other side of the world):

1. The army pulls out completely and lets the guerrillas take over, like the Soviets in Afghanistan.
   
2. The army makes a compromise, knowing that they might just be postponing their total defeat, like the British in Ireland.
   
3. The army completely wipes out the guerrillas with massive casualties to local (often affiliated) civilians, like Sri Lanka and the Tamil Tigers.
   

Sri Lanka is actually the only instance of the third scenario that I can think of, though there are probably other examples.  But it's very hard to completely wipe out a guerrilla force that enjoys support from the local population.  I don't think the United States has the will or attitude to adopt the kind of brutality necessary to do that, nor do I think we really should.  I'm not a fan of the Taliban, but I'm even less a fan of war.  If we want this war to end I think the US should negotiate, because "staying the course" is clearly not working.

Perhaps more importantly, the governments of both Pakistan and Afghanistan, which we are supposed to be allied with, are actively trying to negotiate with the Taliban and have been for some time.  But so long as the US military continues operating in those two countries, any viable peace process would require US involvement.  It's not a particularly attractive option, but since when are negotiations to end a stalemated war ever fun?

The New York Times has a really interesting set of opinion pieces from 2009 that discuss this same question much more eloquently than I did.

http://roomfordebate.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/09/01/is-it-time-to-negotiate-with-the-taliban/

I shall have  read of that Eldo and let you know what I think, but I thought you raised some good points in your own piece.

Certainly with the Ireland thing negotiations were the key, Thatcher was big on the 'we dont deal with terrorists' line but under Major and then Blair (who takes a lot of credit but really  just completed the process already long under way) behind the scenes negotiations were taking place.

I cant imagine the majority of those in NI don't want to go back to the Troubles.

My only quibble with your analysis is I dont think it was a defeat for the army or the politicians, a compromised settlement is a win if it stops the deaths on both sides.


I note however the US State Department has put out a response to Pakistani claims they have scuppered the peace process-

"The US state department spokesman said: "The issue of whether to negotiate with TTP is an internal matter for Pakistan, and we refer you to the government of Pakistan for further details."

That seems incredibly unhelpful to me.