The Eagles (And Why They Didn't Fly the Ring All the Way to Mordor)

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Thu Sep 24, 2015 5:19 pm

I am saying in this case Gwaihir's use of the word command does not so much mean that he has to do it, or that Galadriel actually had to command him to do it rather than just tell him what was going on- the solution would after all be obvious to them both- but rather Gwaihir's use of the word if just reflective of Galadriels status.
In the UK the Queen never asks, she commands, because it just wouldn't be done, not the right thing, to say she asked- makes her sound common- she is the Queen!
Gwaihir saying he was commanded is therefore merely a language quirk, reflective of Galadriels status.

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Post by David H Thu Sep 24, 2015 5:24 pm

Am I wrong that in the passage in question Gandalf is translating a conversation spoken in Eaglish into the Common Speech? If so, we need to consider the original choice of words by Gwaihir in his own tongue, as well as what the social role of command vs. request was within eagle culture. Even among ourselves and within a single language, I seem to be seeing slight differences of usage.

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Post by halfwise Thu Sep 24, 2015 5:31 pm

True.  In cat language the word 'command' would be untranslatable...as would request, bid etc.  

But 'plead' would be in there. Nod That translates just fine.

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Post by Radaghast Thu Sep 24, 2015 5:35 pm

Maybe it's meant more in the sense of an instruction than an order.

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Post by halfwise Thu Sep 24, 2015 6:28 pm

Rolling Eyes We've been through that. Read back a page.

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Post by Radaghast Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:03 pm

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:06 pm

Laughing

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Post by azriel Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:24 pm

Laughing

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Post by halfwise Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:45 pm

Well, not reading back just wastes our time, which is obviously valuable enough...um....that we spend it ... err .... (on here Embarassed).

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:48 pm

Nod Very Happy

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Post by malickfan Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:52 pm

I wonder if this question would have been asked so frequently if Jackson had kept the  'run you fools' line in the FOTR movie instead of changing it back to 'Fly' on home video, as it stands some viewers may have mistaken Tolkien's archaic wording as Gandalf pointing out a plot hole on his apparent death 'Bugger lads...I've just thought of something'... Laughing

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I think what comes out of a pig's rear end is more akin to what Peejers has given us-Azriel 20/9/2014
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Post by Eldorion Fri Sep 25, 2015 7:38 am

I've seen the suggestion that "fly" was meant literally made many times over the years, usually in jest, but I don't think it was until this fan theory went viral last August that the interpretation became really common.

http://www.tickld.com/x/this-guy-just-changed-the-way-we-see-lord-of-the-rings-mind-blown

(And it really did blow up overnight. I first became aware of it when trying to figure out where all the extra traffic on my site's Eagle article had come from. Usually big jumps in traffic are because someone posted the link on Reddit or Facebook. But this was the biggest spike in traffic I've ever had and it came not from any link but just thousands of people making Google searches about the Eagles and following the top links, one of which was mine.)
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Post by Eldorion Sun Oct 18, 2015 10:26 pm

So apparently the Huffington Post asked both Elijah Wood and Sean Astin about the aforementioned fan theory in two recent interviews and fortunately both of them shot it down.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/lord-of-the-rings-cast-major-fan-theory_561dca5fe4b028dd7ea5b392
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Post by Bluebottle Mon Oct 19, 2015 4:05 am

*snort* That's so ridiculous, it's kind of funny. Razz

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Post by Forest Shepherd Mon Oct 19, 2015 8:47 pm

Hm... Sean Astin says in that interview that he never really liked how the eagles came to the rescue of the dwarves in The Hobbit "because it just felt like they could whenever they wanted to".
This sounds like confusion with the idea as presented in the movie, as it is very clearly set-up in the book that the only reason the eagles come down from their high eyries is that they notice the widespread flames and hubbub in the forest below and wish to investigate what mischief is afoot.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Mon Oct 19, 2015 8:59 pm

And when they see who it is, Gwahir owes Gandalf a favour, otherwise they might just have flown back home again.

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