FREEDOM!!!! [4]

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Wed Jan 05, 2022 11:53 pm

at least if you are a man you can fight back- Figg

{{ if you're a man it's not as simple as that. What if you say no, turn from the fight, ignore the insult? Intellectually you might be able to justify that, being the better man, not stooping to their level.
But on a fundamental level of maleness you know what really just happened, it's the two stags clashing antlers, and you're the one that's having to limp away defeated. You know it, he knows it. And it's so fundamentally hot wired in that no intellectual argument prevents it damaging the male psyche. And if it happens to you repeatedly, the cumulative effect can be depression, lack of self-confidence, or worse. There's no good outcome either way; fight or walk. Defending yourself is one thing, responding to a direct challenge from another man quite another.

And it's all these little pressure which affect a man's sense of who he is and where he belongs that can lead to so many mental health issues in men, and they are woefully unaddressed. Whereas, health care in general for women is far more prominent and better supported (ironically that might be partly the fault of men, as most of the NHS's history men ran it and prioritised women's health care as they were the ones who had the babies. The male instinct to protect the female as child bearer ahead of promoting health care for our own sex).}}

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Post by halfwise Thu Jan 06, 2022 3:27 am

Hmm....just noticed the strong prevalence of gingers on this forum (3 by my count) - I wish I could say this place attracts misfits, but having red hair doesn't quite deserve such honor.

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Post by Lancebloke Thu Jan 06, 2022 7:45 am

Mrs Figg wrote:
Lancebloke wrote:I didnt get jobs because of it. I was told plain and simple. You don't get to pick what is discrimination because it does r fit the narrative.

As I said, that was your choice, and it is no different from me going to work looking scruffy. That is not discrimination in any way, its the policy of your workplace. In certain jobs you have to look a certain way and dress correctly, its absurd to say that is discrimination. Nobody ever won a law suit for having long hair at work unless you are a Rasta and its your religion.

Picking and choosing again. Long hair is not in the dress code. Tattoos were but depending on who was running a particular building, not corporate policy.

Why is that not discrimination? Picking on a characteristic of someone for the sake of you not liking that characteristic is not discrimination? And because I could change makes that OK? Why the fuck should I have to change? Why can't a woman just know her place and look after kids or become a secretary instead? Because she shouldn't fucking have to, that's why!!!

Bullshit double standards that has gone from a time when women and minorities really had a point to creating a culture of victimhood so that we both can't address any remaining causes of inequality and at the age time blame others for our own failings... because it really must be someone else's fault.

Petty - I agree with most of what you just said too. Hundreds of thousands of years of evolution with the sexes having to fulfil different roles by necessity has been turned on its head in the last 150 years and now we have phrases like "toxic masculinity" being thrown about by "progressives" as much as "wokeness" is a label hard-core conservatives throw at everything they don't agree with. Does it exist... yes. Is every masculine trait toxic...? Seems quite a lot is.
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Post by Lancebloke Thu Jan 06, 2022 7:46 am

halfwise wrote:Hmm....just noticed the strong prevalence of gingers on this forum (3 by my count) - I wish I could say this place attracts misfits, but having red hair doesn't quite deserve such honor.

I have a ginger cousin and niece... managed to avoid that humiliation myself.
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Post by Mrs Figg Thu Jan 06, 2022 11:58 am

Lancebloke wrote:
Mrs Figg wrote:
Lancebloke wrote:I didnt get jobs because of it. I was told plain and simple. You don't get to pick what is discrimination because it does r fit the narrative.

As I said, that was your choice, and it is no different from me going to work looking scruffy. That is not discrimination in any way, its the policy of your workplace. In certain jobs you have to look a certain way and dress correctly, its absurd to say that is discrimination. Nobody ever won a law suit for having long hair at work unless you are a Rasta and its your religion.

Picking and choosing again. Long hair is not in the dress code. Tattoos were but depending on who was running a particular building, not corporate policy.

Why is that not discrimination? Picking on a characteristic of someone for the sake of you not liking that characteristic is not discrimination? And because I could change makes that OK? Why the fuck should I have to change? Why can't a woman just know her place and look after kids or become a secretary instead? Because she shouldn't fucking have to, that's why!!!

Bullshit double standards that has gone from a time when women and minorities really had a point to creating a culture of victimhood so that we both can't address any remaining causes of inequality and at the age time blame others for our own failings... because it really must be someone else's fault.

Petty - I agree with most of what you just said too. Hundreds of thousands of years of evolution with the sexes having to fulfil different roles by necessity has been turned on its head in the last 150 years and now we have phrases like "toxic masculinity" being thrown about by "progressives" as much as "wokeness" is a label hard-core conservatives throw at everything they don't agree with. Does it exist... yes. Is every masculine trait toxic...? Seems quite a lot is.

No, I am not picking and choosing. To say that having long hair is a protected trait like race, gender, disability or religion is ludicrous. Rightly people cannot be discriminated against because of age/race/sex/gender/religion/disability, but if anyone tried to add 'having long hair' to that list they would be laughed out of court. Its ridiculous. Not worth the thought really. Having long hair is a fashion statement, you have a choice about it, and you are still a young white male, therefore privileged, you don't have a knobbing choice about being in a wheelchair or Jewish.
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Post by Lancebloke Thu Jan 06, 2022 12:36 pm

Women have a choice to not apply for that job. I have a choice to pretend to be someone I'm not...

You are very much picking and choosing.

And you have no idea about what "privilege" I do or don't have.
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Post by Mrs Figg Thu Jan 06, 2022 2:00 pm

:drum: ok
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Post by Lancebloke Thu Jan 06, 2022 3:47 pm

Very Happy
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Post by Mrs Figg Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:20 pm

Kissing
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Post by halfwise Fri Jan 07, 2022 1:03 am

I see cause to insert this: the original Brunhilda and her counterpart.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/medieval-queens-daring-reigns-quickly-forgotten-180979246/

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Post by Amarië Fri Jan 14, 2022 11:53 am

I can't quite decide if I should try to move the trans/feminist discussion to a new thread or just leave it. I do not agree with all that's been said - and in this day and age a trigger warning surely should be added - , but I do appreciate how thoroughly this thread has been norced while at the same time remaining fitting for the thread's title. Who's freedom it is, well... that's clearly up for debate.

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Post by Mrs Figg Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:17 pm

Forumshire is probably not the ideal forum for such issues as its a difficult topic and could have gone ballistic, but I appreciate there was at least a debate and I was allowed an opinion. To be fair, I think we agreed to disagree on some points. Its very common to be cancelled or have a pile on if a person doesn't follow the current 'no debate' agenda in the UK, the States, and Canada, but I think the current no debate agenda sucks. But that's just me.
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