A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
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A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Wed Feb 24, 2016 11:44 am
Eldorion wrote:I, uh, am not really sure what to make of this article. How can anyone who has read the books once, much less multiple times, not have noticed that Oberyn is an asshole?
I was mostly going of his Tyrion conversations with that. I guess I just always read them in the light of some real respect being there, and as such didn't read asmuch into what Oberyn actually said. You can be quite harsh on someone and not mean it harshly at all.
The article, I think tries to take the premise of him being immidiately likeable and running with all the reasons that first impression might be problematic. (Not that I'm in any way dismissing any of your points.)
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“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
![A Song of Ice and Fire [2] Tumblr_msgi12FPjq1s8au6qo2_500](https://33.media.tumblr.com/de58a4b1ea8094e414d274be9532e12d/tumblr_msgi12FPjq1s8au6qo2_500.gif)
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Eldorion Wed Feb 24, 2016 6:46 pm
Cheers, Blue.
My take on Oberyn and Tyrion's relationship (though, admittedly, it's been a while since I've read the books) is that while Oberyn seems to have developed some respect for Tyrion by his death, he initially had almost as little regard for Tyrion as he did for the rest of the Lannisters, simply because of the family name.
My take on Oberyn and Tyrion's relationship (though, admittedly, it's been a while since I've read the books) is that while Oberyn seems to have developed some respect for Tyrion by his death, he initially had almost as little regard for Tyrion as he did for the rest of the Lannisters, simply because of the family name.
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Thu Feb 25, 2016 3:15 pm
Yeah, I guess I'm just not quite as on board with the acting like an asshole making you an asshole idea.
I do find the question of whether he acted the same around other people like he did around Tyrion interesting though. The article says he probably didn't around Tywinn, as Tywinn didn't consider him a threat. But I consider it might quite likely have been the opposite. Tywinn might not have considered a rash, brash and self-important prince as much of a threath as a cold calculating one like himself.
I do find the question of whether he acted the same around other people like he did around Tyrion interesting though. The article says he probably didn't around Tywinn, as Tywinn didn't consider him a threat. But I consider it might quite likely have been the opposite. Tywinn might not have considered a rash, brash and self-important prince as much of a threath as a cold calculating one like himself.
_________________
“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Ringdrotten Thu Mar 10, 2016 10:18 am
Blue, I'm getting close to book 4 in my current GoT re-read project, any chance you could post that "books 4+5 combined" thing again? 
I could google it, but if you've tried it and found it worked as well as you say, I'd rather not risk finding a different setup if you get what I mean.
I could google it, but if you've tried it and found it worked as well as you say, I'd rather not risk finding a different setup if you get what I mean. _________________
“The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want for nothing. He makes me lie down in the green pastures. He greases up my head with oil. He gives me kung-fu in the face of my enemies. Amen”. - Tom Cullen
![A Song of Ice and Fire [2] Man-in-black](https://thelissachronicles.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/man-in-black.jpg?w=484&h=332)
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Fri Mar 11, 2016 3:57 pm
Sure thing. 
I'm really interested to hear what you make of it.
Bluebottle wrote:Yeah, I did it with the audiobooks, which is easier, but even with the physical copies you mostly stay with each book for a couple of chapters at a time except for at the start.http://boiledleather.com/post/25902554148/a-new-readerfriendly-combined-reading-order-for-a
- Spoiler:
Prologue: AFFC 1
The Prophet: AFFC 2
The Captain of Guards: AFFC 3
Cersei I: AFFC 4
Tyrion I: ADWD 2
Daenerys I: ADWD 3
Brienne I: AFFC 5
Jon I: ADWD 4
Bran I: ADWD 5
Tyrion II: ADWD 6
Samwell I: AFFC 6
Jon II: ADWD 8
Arya I: AFFC 7
Cersei II: AFFC 8
Jaime I: AFFC 9
Brienne II: AFFC 10
Sansa I: AFFC 11
The Kraken’s Daughter: AFFC 12
Tyrion III: ADWD 9
Davos I: ADWD 10
Jon III: ADWD 11
Daenerys II: ADWD 12
Reek I: ADWD 13
Cersei III: AFFC 13
The Soiled Knight: AFFC 14
Bran II: ADWD 14
Tyrion IV: ADWD 15
Davos II: ADWD 16
Brienne III: AFFC 15
Samwell II: AFFC 16
Daenerys III: ADWD 17
Jon IV: ADWD 18
Jaime II: AFFC 17
Tyrion V: ADWD 19
Cersei IV: AFFC 18
Davos III: ADWD 20
The Iron Captain: AFFC 19
The Drowned Man: AFFC 20
Brienne IV: AFFC 21
The Queenmaker: AFFC 22
Arya II: AFFC 23
Alayne I: AFFC 24
The Princess in the Tower: AFFC 41
The Merchant’s Man: ADWD 7
Cersei V: AFFC 25
Reek II: ADWD 21
Jon V: ADWD 22
Tyrion VI: ADWD 23
Daenerys IV: ADWD 24
The Lost Lord: ADWD 25
The Windblown: ADWD 26
The Wayward Bride: ADWD 27
Brienne V: AFFC 26
Samwell III: AFFC 27
Jaime III: AFFC 28
Tyrion VII: ADWD 28
Jon VI: ADWD 29
Davos IV: ADWD 30
Cersei VI: AFFC 29
The Reaver: AFFC 30
Daenerys V: ADWD 31
Melisandre I: ADWD 32
Jaime IV: AFFC 31
Brienne VI: AFFC 32
Reek III: ADWD 33
Tyrion VIII: ADWD 34
Cersei VII: AFFC 33
Jaime V: AFFC 34
Cat of the Canals: AFFC 35
Samwell IV: AFFC 36
Cersei VIII: AFFC 37
Brienne VII: AFFC 38
Jaime VI: AFFC 39
Cersei IX: AFFC 40 [remember, you can skip Chapter 41: The Princess in the Tower, because you already read it]
Bran III: ADWD 35
Jon VII: ADWD 36
Daenerys VI: ADWD 37
The Prince of Winterfell: ADWD 38
The Watcher: ADWD 39
Jon VIII: ADWD 40
Tyrion IX: ADWD 41
The Turncloak: ADWD 42
The King’s Prize: ADWD 43
Daenerys VII: ADWD 44
Alayne II: AFFC 42
Jon IX: ADWD 45
Brienne VIII: AFFC 43
Cersei X: AFFC 44
Jaime VII: AFFC 45
Samwell V: AFFC 46
The Blind Girl: ADWD 46
A Ghost in Winterfell: ADWD 47
Tyrion X: ADWD 48
Jaime VIII: ADWD 49
Jon X: ADWD 50
Daenerys VIII: ADWD 51
Theon VII: ADWD 52
Daenerys IX: ADWD 53
Jon XI: ADWD 54
Cersei XI: ADWD 55
The Queensguard: ADWD 56
The Iron Suitor: ADWD 57
Tyrion XI: ADWD 58
Jon XII: ADWD 59
The Discarded Knight: ADWD 60
The Spurned Suitor: ADWD 61
The Griffin Reborn: ADWD 62
The Sacrifice: ADWD 63
Victarion: ADWD 64
The Ugly Little Girl: ADWD 65
Cersei XII: ADWD 66
Tyrion XII: ADWD 67
The Kingbreaker: ADWD 68
The Dragontamer: ADWD 69
Jon XIII: ADWD 70
The Queen’s Hand: ADWD 71
Daenerys X: ADWD 72
Epilogue: ADWD 73
Also reading this way the scope of the story simply stuns you. Trust me, you never want to go back. (When it comes to the difference, it's the change from Cersei I to Tyrion I that really floors you. (It just seems so natural.))
I'm really interested to hear what you make of it.
_________________
“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Ringdrotten Fri Mar 11, 2016 7:14 pm
Great, thanks! I'll be reading the books on my Kindle, so I don't think the switching will be any bother at all, it's quite easy and quick to go back and forth between books Can't wait, you've got my expectations well up with all that talk 
Can't wait, you've got my expectations well up with all that talk _________________
“The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want for nothing. He makes me lie down in the green pastures. He greases up my head with oil. He gives me kung-fu in the face of my enemies. Amen”. - Tom Cullen
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Ringdrotten Fri Mar 11, 2016 7:18 pm
I might also add that I'm enjoying the series even more this time around, there are so many things I never noticed the first time, little details and hints everywhere. Still pretty fed up with Catelyn by the time she dies (her constant whining, understandable though it is) and skipping most Bran chapters up until they're beyond the wall, but the rest of it is just pure "leseglede"
_________________
“The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want for nothing. He makes me lie down in the green pastures. He greases up my head with oil. He gives me kung-fu in the face of my enemies. Amen”. - Tom Cullen
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Fri Mar 11, 2016 8:18 pm
Great. I might have said it before, but I don't have like a memory card for my phone, so limited storage, and for a long time the only thing I had on there was the combined audiobook of aFfCs and aDwDs and I must have listened through it at least 4/5 times. And, yeah, I'm a real fan.
I might have said it before, but I don't have like a memory card for my phone, so limited storage, and for a long time the only thing I had on there was the combined audiobook of aFfCs and aDwDs and I must have listened through it at least 4/5 times. And, yeah, I'm a real fan. _________________
“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Ringdrotten Mon Mar 21, 2016 3:42 pm
Project Combined Reading has officially commenced, very excited to see how this goes
_________________
“The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want for nothing. He makes me lie down in the green pastures. He greases up my head with oil. He gives me kung-fu in the face of my enemies. Amen”. - Tom Cullen
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Wed Mar 23, 2016 2:04 pm
Ringdrotten wrote:Project Combined Reading has officially commenced, very excited to see how this goes
(The jump from Cersei I to Tyrion I was when it hit me.
)_________________
“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Ringdrotten Mon Apr 04, 2016 1:59 pm
Is Cersei Lannister ever referred to as Cersei Baratheon? 
?
?_________________
“The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want for nothing. He makes me lie down in the green pastures. He greases up my head with oil. He gives me kung-fu in the face of my enemies. Amen”. - Tom Cullen
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by halfwise Mon Apr 04, 2016 3:34 pm
Good question. I don't remember it ever done in books or film. But Blue seems to have search capabilities, maybe he'll find out for you.
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Eldorion Mon Apr 04, 2016 4:10 pm
I don't recall her ever being referred to as such. I thought I recalled Catelyn being referred to as "Catelyn Tully" fairly regularly, but I just went back and control-F'd my way through AGOT and ACOK and it only seems to come up when discussing her life or pre-marriage or when Littlefinger is creeping on her. So perhaps Cersei can just get away with bucking the trend cause of who her family them sharing her disdain for Robert, even though he was King?
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Mon Apr 04, 2016 4:46 pm
By then the others were dismounting as well, and grooms were coming forward for their
mounts. Robert’s queen, Cersei Lannister, entered on foot with her younger children.
The wheelhouse in which they had ridden, a huge double-decked carriage of oiled oak
and gilded metal pulled by forty heavy draft horses, was too wide to pass through the
castle gate. Ned knelt in the snow to kiss the queen’s ring, while Robert embraced
Catelyn like a long-lost sister. Then the children had been brought forward, introduced,
and approved of by both sides.
_________________
“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Mon Apr 04, 2016 4:46 pm
I can probably do a more proper search later, but I can't remember it happening.
_________________
“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Ringdrotten Mon Apr 04, 2016 5:06 pm
Eldorion wrote:I don't recall her ever being referred to as such. I thought I recalled Catelyn being referred to as "Catelyn Tully" fairly regularly
Only when speaking of her past - her named changed to Catelyn Stark when she wed. When she captures Tyrion at that inn she says "I was still Catelyn Tully the last time" something something - I think she says that in the book as well, so one should think that women took the names of their husbands
It could be as you say, though, that the Lannisters are so powerful they get away with keeping their name even when wedding kings. Sounds odd, but can't remember her ever being referred to as a Baratheon._________________
“The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want for nothing. He makes me lie down in the green pastures. He greases up my head with oil. He gives me kung-fu in the face of my enemies. Amen”. - Tom Cullen
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Mon Apr 04, 2016 5:10 pm
Maybe you've spotted a goof by George, with the "I used to be Catelyn Tully." thing. (Meaning he's not consistent.)
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“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Eldorion Mon Apr 04, 2016 5:44 pm
I don't know that it's a goof, but there don't seem to be consistent rules. Elia is always referred to as "Elia Martell" or "Elia of Dorne", even when discussing her life after marriage. On the other hand, Lysa seems to be exclusively "Lysa Arryn" post-marriage. Too lazy to try to find more data points right now. 
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Wed May 11, 2016 11:33 am
And George is back to make sure we don't think the books in any way will go in the direction of the show. (I find it funny that every time they butcher one of his storylines he releases another sample chapter.)
http://www.georgerrmartin.com/excerpt-from-the-winds-of-winter/
Ps. This has been read at conventions prevously, but there's never been a print version or a recording available. Just fan synopsises from the readings.
http://www.georgerrmartin.com/excerpt-from-the-winds-of-winter/
Ps. This has been read at conventions prevously, but there's never been a print version or a recording available. Just fan synopsises from the readings.
_________________
“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Wed May 11, 2016 12:20 pm
http://grrm.livejournal.com/487298.htmlYou want to know what the Sand Snakes, Prince Doran, Areo Hotah, Ellaria Sand, Darkstar, and the rest will be up to in WINDS OF WINTER? Quite a lot, actually. The sample will give you a taste. For the rest, you will need to wait.
You've gotta love George.
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“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Ringdrotten Wed May 11, 2016 1:24 pm
Staying well away from all such samples and tastes - want the whole book to be new when I read it Still, I like the sound of "And George is back to make sure we don't think the books in any way will go in the direction of the show." I like it very much
Still, I like the sound of "And George is back to make sure we don't think the books in any way will go in the direction of the show." I like it very much _________________
“The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want for nothing. He makes me lie down in the green pastures. He greases up my head with oil. He gives me kung-fu in the face of my enemies. Amen”. - Tom Cullen
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by halfwise Wed May 11, 2016 2:04 pm
I only saw one real spoiler in the excerpt, well okay, maybe two.
It's nice to get a true taste of Sand Snakes again.
It's nice to get a true taste of Sand Snakes again.
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Wed May 11, 2016 2:06 pm
I've read the first sample chapters of the charactes that has been published, some of which are great and a real appatizer for the coming book, but not the second ones. I thought that would be getting a bit to ahead of oneself, reading a bit too much of what one's waiting for.
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“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by Bluebottle Wed May 11, 2016 2:07 pm
You probably should have read this before reading that, Halfwise. That's the second chapter from Winds that character has had released.
http://archive.is/2PS7R
http://archive.is/2PS7R
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“We're doomed,” he says, casually. “There's no question about that. But it's OK to be doomed because then you can just enjoy your life."
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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire [2]
by halfwise Wed May 11, 2016 2:33 pm
So I can move one of the spoilers to that first chapter.
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