All New Who

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Post by Mrs Figg Sun Dec 05, 2021 8:45 pm

Liked the chocolate lust though, I can relate to that.
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:21 pm

Spoiler:

The Flux series overall gets a 3 from me. There's a couple of decent moments sprinkled in isolation, but as soon as you have the whole story and try to put all the bits we've been given together it doesn't make a lick of sense on any level, and most of what you watched did not serve any point and was unnecessary. Makes the series long Trial of a Timelord look impressive by comparison and cant even begin to lick the boots of 2nd Doctor 10 part series long War Games. If you want a decent long single Who narrative watch either of those over this nonsense every time. }}

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Post by Mrs Figg Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:08 pm

Basically it was fluff dressed up as Obama. It looked like Obama and it talked like Obama, but it ain't Obama. Its fluff.
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Mon Dec 06, 2021 11:02 pm

{{ The Ai will be interesting should have it soon. I'll be gobsmacked if this mess felt satisfactory to a general audience (my mum who has watched Who in a casaul way since it began in the 60's commented to me, 'I didnt know what was going on and what I did know was going on didn't seem to make much sense.' She has a succinct form of crabbit all her own) and I'll eat a mouldy patch of my kilt if this gets 80 or above. And if it doesn't then the entire series will be sub-80 AI's. Which would be a terrible (but fair) record for this era. So place your bets, above or below 80? Will it be the worse series ever for Ai's or will the finale buck the trend and prove popular?}}

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Post by Mrs Figg Tue Dec 07, 2021 1:41 pm

Regardless. Please don't eat a patch of your mouldy kilt. No
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Wed Dec 08, 2021 1:59 pm

{{ Looks like I'm spared mouldy kilt dinner, the Ai was another terrible 76.
Thats all sorts of bad new records for Chibnall- smashes the previous showrunners low score count many times over, first time an entire series has failed to get a single episode 80 or above, worst score for a finale and most consecutive episodes with sub-80 scores.

To give the awfulness of this achievement its full glory heres the stats for comparison -

RTD- 2/60
Moffat- 1/84
Chibnall- 13/28

Thats almost half the enire run of Chibnall Who has scored badly by the BBC's own internal measuring system. I'm amazed he's been allowed to carry on with 3 specials. }}

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Post by Amarië Wed Dec 08, 2021 7:25 pm

Watching the sunday episode new. Just startet, but... what the heck is happening with the clipping? I'm getting dizzy. Weird thing to do. It's not adding anything to the doctor's ramblings. Or anything else.  Suspect

Also, no hug or anything for Dan. Poor Dan, but he clearly doesn't care.

Ugh... this is getting dumber and dumber...

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Wed Dec 08, 2021 7:27 pm

{{ Good luck! Cant wait to hear your thoughts on the um, 'resolutions' to the plot points. Some of the worst tv Ive ever seen. }}

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Post by Amarië Wed Dec 08, 2021 8:41 pm

I quite agree with your mum. Nothing made sense. A whole lot or nonsense stuff going on and ending in nonsense. Also queerbaiting, and isn't it extremely rude and racist to call Kalvanist a dog and giggle about haha a family and their dog, and generally ignoring his feelings about anything?


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Post by Pettytyrant101 Wed Dec 08, 2021 8:55 pm

{{ Well his entire race has just been wiped out, what you expecting someone to mention it, show any humanity, the Doctor to give a fig? in Chibnall Who? Far as I can tell they're are four genocides in this one episode- the Lupari, the Cybermen, Daleks and Sontarans- all wiped out by the Flux, not to mention the billions of planets destroyed, or the further billions taken to make magic space travel juice for Swarm and Azure. None of whch warrants a single note of concern, empathy or concern from this supposed Doctor.

Compare the 4th Doctor contamplating genocide-



And how the Doctor, 8 regenerations later, when finally in the position to carry out his own metaphor and stop Davros before he even started reacted -



How on earth is anyone supposed to take this cos-player impressionist seriously as the same character? She doesnt seem to give a shit at all the billions of dead, its all cheery lets go off on adventures by the end. What? Where? Whats left?}}

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Post by Amarië Wed Dec 08, 2021 9:22 pm

Well 13 did look at him with sympathy and maybe even remorse for several seconds. It was the most genuine decent acting of feelings I've seen her do, I think. It was forgotten quickly though, of course.

I can't begin to imagine what the specials will be about.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Wed Dec 08, 2021 9:32 pm

{{ 3 specials of misery as they wander the shattered remenants of whats left of the universe, watch earth die from a lack of you know, everything it needs not too like a moon, and other planets, and a sun. While the Doctor expositions about if she should or should not open the fob watch.

Alternatively, and I am suspecting this is where it will go everything will be magically fixed somehow offscreen and the Flux stuff undone, Chibnall will in the final episode, just to make the Doctors departure more tragic you understand, have Yaz and 13 declare their love for one another and have one single first and last kiss before she regens. And the fob watch and the Timeless Child stuff wont come up again save in the context of destroyed Galilfrey/Master/Timelord Cybermen, but on terms of Division, Ruth Doctor and the memories we will not hear another word about. Oh and my money is on the Grand Serpent reappearing and being revealed as Rassilon all along. }}

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Post by Amarië Wed Dec 08, 2021 9:41 pm

But didn't
Spoiler:

Actually, never mind... Can't expect any form of consistency here.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Wed Dec 08, 2021 9:57 pm

{{ The Flux certainly has some very plot related powers shall we say! Its a massive universe spanning event that pulverises all in its path, when its not a localised event that sometimes just leaves stuff half destoryed. Its gignormous and small enough to get sooked up by a humaniod sized object in 2 seconds flat. It happens twice? (in the first episode the date we are told for the Flux event is Halloween, its kind of the point of that episode it being set on and broadcast on Halloween. Yet in the Yaz globe trotting find the date stuff she says they know its in December but not the year? So it happens twice? Or Yaz and the Doctor forgot they already know the date it happens because they WERE THERE WHEN IT HAPPENED!!!) It devours mass - planets, suns, black holes, anything in its path, but its made of anti-matter and matter also slows and destroys it? So shouldn't it be getting smaller and smaller all the time as it eats up matter? It can eat entire solar systems, but not a fleet of Dalek and a fleet of Cybermen ships without that being too much matter for it? And Swarm and Azure can rewind it and rerun it over and over (and maybe Division can as its slightly implied they can do it because they are at Divsion HQ? But then why would Divsion build in a rewind button? They are leaving the universe for another one?) But then why would Divisoin unleash a universe destroying thing like the Flux to kill the Doctor if they a) kidnap her and try to take her with them anyway to the new universe and b) could have brought her here at anytime and just killed her or thrown in her in a black hole or something? Why destroy the entire universe you and your Division have spent centuries, possibly millenia building up to infiltatre everywhere and every group of note in the universe? Plus Techtummytum says the aim of Divisin is to protect the universe and they achieved that aim. As she destoys it! What was their a Divsion board meeting where they all voted on this as being the best course of action for dealing with the Doctor, entire universal destruction and moving univeres? Its all so awful in so many different ways.

edit add- due to a drunken rant getting me sidetracked drunken meant to say if it was reversed we never saw it- all we saw was Passenger sook it up and away.}}

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Wed Dec 08, 2021 11:56 pm

{{ This is fun to cheer the mood. A Missy trailer using the Cruella trailer. Works surprisingly well together. And of course Michelle Gomez's amazing turn in the role is always worth a watch. She is pure entertainment. Laughing }}


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Post by Mrs Figg Thu Dec 09, 2021 12:08 am

I just hope RTD can pull off another 2005. There are so many expectations, I have more expectations for this, than the new LOTRs or GoTs.
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Thu Dec 09, 2021 12:12 am

{{ I actually think this shit show of Cibnalls might help a bit. If RTD plays to his own strengths we can at least expect quality character driven story-lines, the plotting will probably still be ropey and the endings pulling rabits out of hats, but I think audiences will be so pleased and rlevied to have relatable, believable characters again they can invest in it will cover a lot of the other cracks, as it did when he was at his best orginally. }}

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Post by Amarië Thu Dec 09, 2021 10:48 am

Yeah, I think you are right. Good luck, RTD!

Oddly enough we might have new Who that starts of with the Doctor as the only timelord, Gallifrey destroyed and the Doctor burdoned with guilt of genoside.  Suspect

But there's plenty of time for the specials to make a bigger mess of things. Yey!

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Post by Mrs Figg Thu Dec 09, 2021 12:40 pm

That's the trick, if you are invested in the characters in the first 5 minutes, you have the audience. Everyone could relate to Rose, Donna, Martha, and Bill. It was getting much harder to relate to Clara because she started to be more than a companion, a bit too big for her boots, but Bill was a return to how companions should be, secondary to the importance of the Doctor. RTD excels in setting up characters, and boy do we need to sigh and go 'yep this'll do'
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Post by Pettytyrant101 Thu Dec 09, 2021 12:56 pm

{{ I never felt Clara was more important than the Doctor, or that he was ever secondary to her, especially not 12. Rather Moffat used Clara like a drop of water, through the prism of her we got to explore the nature and character of the Doctor. 12's journey is the most introspective on the character of the Doctor the show has got- Chibnal thinks he is exploring the Doctor with this Timeless Child rubbish but he really isn't and Moffat already did it far better through Clara.

For me the only real issue with Clara is she was two different writing devices at two different times- with 11 she was not really a companion in the traditional sense, she was part of the plot, the Impossible Girl, and her purpose was to be a bridge for those who grew up on only NuWHo with Classic Who as part of preparing the audience for the 50th Anniversary Special- and the success of that special with NUWHo audiences is in no smal part down to how successful a wrting trick that was with Clara.

But post the 50th and starting with 12 she couldnt be the 'Impossible Girl' anymore, that was resolved and answered her purpose as a bridge between eras served. And its only now we get the companion Clara, with a home life, a job, a love interest, all of which are relatable but again Moffat takes unexpected turns- her romantic line is a tragic one of two people in love who are unsuited to be together and for whom it would never have worked- thats not the usual companion romance line but it is relatable to a lot of folk who have had releationships where there was nothing wrong with the other person, even having strong feelings for them, but it just doesnt work.
And it's throughout this period where her being choosen by Missy because she is so alike in personality to the Doctor and her becoming more and more like him in action that we get to explore the Doctor himself. Its certainly a different use of a companion. But I wouldnt say it anyway deminished the significaince of the Doctor in the stories, quite the opposite. }}

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Post by Mrs Figg Thu Dec 09, 2021 3:05 pm

For me Clara is a bit Marmite, either you get her or you don't. I didn't really. I even prefer the Ponds over Clara.
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Post by Amarië Thu Dec 09, 2021 4:18 pm

Clara never felt like a real person to me. Probably for the reasons you said, Petty.

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Thu Dec 09, 2021 4:32 pm

{{ See that I can understand as reason for not feeling as attached to Clara as other main companions. What I find hard to take is complaints she is badly written, or the show became Doctor Clara. It was neither such thing. She serves both narrative purposes very well.

12 is my favourite Doctor of NuWho and up there with my all time greats of 2, 4 BF 8, but a large part of that is the journey he goes on after recombining his memories of all he did in the Time War, with enduring a thousand year long warfare seige and how that develops into him trying to understand on a personal level what does it actually mean to be the Doctor? And has he been a force for good in the balance? And Clara is instrumental in how that exploration of character happens. }}

CLARA: Look at you. The three of you. The warrior, the hero, and you.
DOCTOR: And what am I?
CLARA: Have you really forgotten?
DOCTOR: Yes. Maybe, yes.
CLARA: We've got enough warriors. Any old idiot can be a hero.
DOCTOR: Then what do I do?
CLARA: What you've always done. Be a doctor.

"I don't mean the war. I'll lose any war you like. I'm sick of losing people. Look at you, with your eyes, and your never giving up, and your anger, and your kindness. One day, the memory of that will hurt so much that I won't be able to breathe, and I'll do what I always do. I'll get in my box and I'll run and I'll run, in case all the pain ever catches up. And every place I go, it will be there."- 12

"There's no such thing as the Doctor. I'm just a bloke in a box, telling stories. And I didn't come here because I'm ashamed. A bit of shame never hurt anyone. I came because you're sick and you asked. And because sometimes, on a good day, if I try very hard, I'm not some old Time Lord who ran away. I'm the Doctor."- 12

"You. Now, you listen to me. You're going to be alone now, and you're very bad at that. You're going to be furious and you're going to be sad, but listen to me. Don't let this change you. No, listen. Whatever happens next, wherever she is sending you, I know what you're capable of. You don't be a Warrior. Promise me. Be a Doctor." - Clara

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Post by Pettytyrant101 Sat Dec 11, 2021 2:31 am

{{ Moffat and RTD have been chatting. }}

"He's told me his plans, and they're so fantastic. He's the single best writer in television drama, he sounded so energised and up for it. It's great news for Doctor Who."- Moffat

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Post by Amarië Mon Dec 13, 2021 3:09 pm

I like the enthusiasm. Very Happy

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One does not simply woke into Mordor.
-Mrs Figg

"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth."
-Marcus Aurelius

 #amarieco
Amarië
Amarië
Dark Planet Ambassador

Posts : 5421
Join date : 2011-06-10
Age : 42
Location : The Dark Planet Embassy, Main str. Needlehole.

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